Freddy Caceres, Police Lieutentant, Miami-Second Nature Leadership

Lieutenant Freddy Caceres is a serving police officer in Miami. He is also the author of the book Second Naturue Leadership. We talk about the nature of the role Freddy inhabits and the frame of reference he brings to the being a leader in that space.

Honest, self effacing and willing to hold space on his ideas, Freddy is a great guest on this episode of LeadershipBITES.

To find out more about Guy Bloom and his award winning work in Team Coaching, Leadership Development and Executive Coaching click below.

The link to everything CLICK HERE
UK: 07827 953814
Email: guybloom@livingbrave.com
Web: www.livingbrave.com

Transcript

0:00

freddie absolutely fantastic to have you on this episode of leadership bites great to be on guy i appreciate uh you know you offered me to be on one of my favorite leadership podcasts out there definitely and the podcast thank you very much yeah and let me tell you what i did was i wanted i usually have nice long hair but i wanted to build a rapport because that's what i do with people so i guess you can see the resemblance you know what it's between you and i it's it's literally uh yeah for those of you who listen who are listening and not watching a picture of me on the back of my own book which i'm being shown which is uh very ego gratifying[Laughter] so i went out and got the same haircut got the same haircut that'd do it it's the way to go you know it's the it's the future so it sure is so listen i came across you on linkedin and uh as seems to be how i come across everybody these days and you know we just resonated with just your profile and i reach out to people when it feels like a kindred spirit and that's always a beautiful thing and of course you've got a book uh which has just recently come out so uh i'm i'm now holding that up and all the kind of the links will um you know will be in the um in the description but second nature leadership and uh and i wanted to talk about it i wanted to get to know you a little bit and um the who you are and the thinking behind it and see where that conversation takes us yeah yeah great what i know a lot about you so i guess this is my opportunity to speak about myself and definitely the book yes thank you for for showing that well that's because i'm uh obviously a a a kind of media ego driven lunatic you know so my whole life's out there but let's let's let's get into you so freddie i would just like to um just you know i know who you are obviously uh but who are you freddie what do you do and uh and then we'll move on from there well thank you uh again i'm glad to be on my name is freddie caceres currently i'm an operations lieutenant for a police department in south florida in the miami-dade county area first and foremost i'm a husband to a wonderful wife who has actually been the inspiration for my leadership journey she has the most natural leadership qualities per se um that i've ever met in anyone so if i emulate anyone it's definitely her and the way she interacts with people so my wife lena i have four children ethan's the oldest ethan is uh currently in the air force he's serving uh in the u.s air force um wesley's 15 he just started driving hence the reason i had to cut my hair like yours guy because i had a lot of a lot more gray hairs now that he's driving um ryan's 14 and abigail's my six-year-old daughter who's actually the ruler of the house of course um but yeah currently uh professionally i'm a police lieutenant i oversee the operations of a police department in south florida in the miami-dade county area um and i started in corporate america and and this was one of the reasons i kind of wrote the book was because i networked for about 13 years at a large telecommunications company um which had several locations throughout the united states and you know i really wasn't happy going to work per se you know they say they say if you love what you do you'll never work a day in your life um so and in that job you know the years went by really fast when you're concentrating on on the operations of a you know of a corporation um so eventually i you know i wanted to be happy so i you know i had a buddy that got into law enforcement and he loved it i did it right along with him um and almost 14 years later i've moved up through the ranks and and here i am running a police department from corporate america to you know to to the public sector so that that's a little bit about myself fantastic um so i visited miami some years ago um it was probably 12 years ago and i landed in miami on hip hop weekend oh wow and uh holy shmoley was that a wake-up call definitely i was i was on the main strip at one of the hotels and i walked in and the lady behind the desk looked at me and she went um first time in miami i went yeah and she said on hip-hop weekend looking at my pale fake pasty face and she said right she said first things first she went um take a look around you and for the next two days because it was friday night she said um probably get a taxi if you leave the hotel yeah funny enough uh that weekend that's memorial weekend there's there's about 40 police departments in the miami-dade county area and we all work uh that area on that weekend so yeah it's uh it's a fun weekend it brings some problems to the community however um it's definitely a unique crowd it's serious well it is and the cars and the the what was going down the strip me thinking i was you know the world's answer to jackie chan probably at the time i take a little bit of a wander out and then i and i thought you know what i might be operating above my pay grade[Laughter] definitely definitely give me a call next time you come and i'll let you know if it's a good weekend to come down to miami so uh yeah so i i get where you are and what you're doing so uh kudos to you so um you know you you gave us a bit of a lead in there about sort of how you got got into the role and um but when it came to the writing a book you know i've been through that process myself and i think everybody thinks how hard can it be and uh i definitely found it uh difficult but i just wondered how on your approach to it what was the cat what was the catalyst what gave you the motivation what was your this is why i want to do it um yeah so i've been witness to ineffective leadership uh throughout my leadership journey and i i want to say that that that may have been one of the main reasons is so my the police organization that i'm i'm in now it it's it's a great place now okay so we have we have leaders in place that that are doing uh what it takes to to run it the way the way we have it with employee satisfaction and the way everything's running however when i entered into the police agency it was a different culture right and again coming from corporate america i i came in just as a police officer right lowest on the rank and uh and i would sit at the roll calls and i would see the way the supervisors you know would function and i was happy being where i was at coming from a management position i said you know what now i'm just going to sit back and i'm going to watch the supervisors do their thing i know what's expected of me and i'm going to shine you know so unfortunately when you when you grow up with a father the way mine was which which was hard-working dedicated and he raised us to be the hardest worker in the room you know he he would definitely disagree with the with the phrase if you're the hardest working but if you're the hardest worker in the room or you're the smartest person in the room you're in the wrong room right so he'd disagree with that he wanted you to you know be the best at everything he did so i mean eventually the time came that a sergeant position became available and uh and i put in for it and then i got i got the role only with a couple couple years in which was unheard of usually people in five plus years or closer to ten um so you know having not having a lot of support as far as trying to to better the organization you know i i i was on my own for a while but i started chipping away at it and uh you know eventually a new police chief came in who who had the same mentality[Music] and i got support from the top you know so um but but there was still the the ineffective leadership um present and and they were there you know they would stick to their old school ways of of dealing with uh with with the current uh generation you know per se so um eventually you know what it's just little little encounters at work and and things that i found were were effective and as the change um the positive changes started occurring you know i said you know what if what if somebody in that in a you know in that position that they're stuck in their ways per se for for the way they supervise you know what if they had the information at hand to read and stuff like that so you know i just started you know i i got the iphone you know late in my life i was you know about 30 years old when they when when i had my first iphone so i had the uh the notes app and i just started making little notes and one thing led to another i started jotting it down and and here i am i'm an author you know so i i never thought i'd be a published offer author however i feel like you know sometimes people need to live through through your experiences you know to change um so that that was the main you know motivation for writing the book is it's just to pass on my experiences um freddie this may sound you know it's not a it's not a trick question but why why do you care enough to do it um definitely in a police organization you know police officers are out there and they're talking to the public and they're in the in the restaurants and in the donut shops and and they're you know you want the public to to know that you know that the men and women of the force are happy you know with what they're doing i have to go out there and then you can you can see them and they're not happy and they don't care you know it's just a reflection of the entire organization and the entire city as a whole um and i've run into it i've lived it i you know i i wrote about it in my book i i was at a restaurant with my wife and and the the waiter came up and i said hey how are you doing today and he says i got 10 tables the manager doesn't hire people three people called out sick you know what i mean um so i told him you know what i believe in you you're going to do a good job you know we're an easy table we're not gonna be too picky you know so i gave him some positive feedback and uh you know and i realized i said you know what this this person is the face right now of this restaurant and he's you know he he's had a little more negative things to say than than i'd rather say but um and i said you know what if the management in place would you know make the employees feel um happy you know to work there they're gonna you know that's gonna resonate with with your customers basically so with policework it's the same thing um no one wants an organization a cashier you know to be talking about how bad the supermarket is um definitely a management physician you don't want your staff uh relating that kind of information so mostly that's that's the reason that's the reason i care is is because the the men and women that represent our agency are your your best campaigners out there you know i mean they're your best um your best source of information as far as how the organization is running so basically that's that's the main reason why i care okay and if i um you know somebody picks up your book what can they expect to find within its pages what are the uh what are the things that you know that's why i'd read that book um guy overall i mean you know i have heard several of your podcasts and and i remember you you mentioning something about a rubbish book that you read and how you didn't want to you know produce a rubbish book and and similarly um i've read several books with a lot of fluff and a lot of rubbish in it that i'm you know i'm going through it and it make it may make me want to skip some pages um and i didn't want anybody to skip the pages i i made the book purposely um uh an easy read um i didn't want to get into a 400 page book so you know i'm not a natural uh charismatic person and that's very important in leadership so basically the the daily effective habits you know to improve your you know your your performance part came into that um you know repetition is the main principle of all learning so self-reflection on encounters and small you know just small day-to-day actions that leaders forget they forget the small things i didn't want to get into graphs and charts and statistics okay so uh day-to-day activity for example i remember walking by my old boss's office and he'd be on his computer and hey fred how you doing you know and that kind of bugged me so you know i wrote about actual encounters in the book every time somebody comes into my office i make it a point to stand up you know i'll stand up i'll shake their hand and i ask them something personal how you doing you know rather than just giving them that you know that wave hey are you doing in that look up from my computer so i had a lot of that in the book um day-to-day you know interactions that i've had with employees uh introducing the cleaning staff uh you know it doesn't matter who's in the building i you know it's it's treating everybody the same way we'll treat the chief of police um our cleaning lady's been there over 30 years you know and she deserves it and actually i just had a police officer from another agency come come over to the police department and he's kind of inquiring on making the switch over to to our agency so he's in police uniform and i'm walking down the hall with him um and basically the as the cleaning lady was walking by i stopped and i said hey look this is officer so-and-so this is you know vicki you know so they kind of you know spoke a little bit you know and he he kind of looked to me and i told him hey listen just so you know this is the way we roll here you know we we're gonna we're gonna treat everyone the same way you know so a lot of those interactions um daily interactions that that have a huge impact um or or situations that i that i have uh wrote in the book basically that you know people could kind of say hey you know what i'm forgetting this stuff you know i'm concentrating too much on x y and z i better go back to the basics and kind of know how to how to interact with your staff i like that so there's something i've got to tickle in the throat here hold on there's um just what i need for a podcast but there's uh the there's something then about um you know you can read you can read the the academic books you can read the theories but um just something about the not the simplicity that's the wrong word but some you know maybe that's it the complexity is in the simplicity definitely doing the basics right maybe that's like in sport you know the best people at the sport are actually the ones that do the basics so well you think they must be doing something else amazing yeah definitely but they're not they're just doing the basics well yeah a lot of people you know they concentrate on on on on factors in the organization and forget that you know don't get me wrong your your i remember in your your podcast with with duke stump um you know the the the former marketing director for nike uh talking about you know nike spelled backwards and how you have to know your organization front and back and i totally agree with that you know there's a lot more to it and i do mention a lot of a lot of stuff like hard work and uh and the first chapter is it's called first in last out because it's what i saw my father do um he was the first one in the organization uh and and the last one to leave um you know so so getting to that leadership position you know there's there's a lot to getting to it um for example we recently for our thanksgiving event we had in the community with giveaway turkeys um so i decided you know i said let me let me take one of my boys so i you know i brought wesley with me the 15 year old and on the way there he you know he asked me uh hey dad can you teach me to be uh a leader a better leader you know so that was music to my ears actually you know so i told him you know it's it's it's a long process there's a magic switch there's not a magic you know you say hey i'm a leader hi you know um so tom this is a great opportunity our mayor's going to be present you know at this event and and that was the opportunity for you uh to show the hard work you know don't be looking on your phone don't be messing around you know so i was able to guide him uh and to you know be seen first be recognized you know get put into those positions to make a difference you know so i do you know there's a there's you know a lot more mentioned in the book about work and but but overall a lot of it is just um relating the the informa the day-to-day information on stuff that i encounter with my employees you seem to me to very much come as i and i notice this in people that are often in roles particularly in the us it seems to really shine to the people that are getting it right for me which is from a position of service and you know that's um that's something that i'm interested in that um because i think the caricature of a police somebody in the police force or especially with social media and some of the stuff that gets out there is um we we see the anomalies i think and not actually the reality of the men and women that are doing that daily that's what we're really about yeah definitely um you know the media is always going to be the media and and they're going to show what sells you know they're very rarely they're going to show a lot of the stuff we do um but yeah there's so much that goes on and uh and it's so important now more than ever to have good leadership especially in law enforcement because you know the way we're seeing uh it's just it's just different times uh and you know i i hate to to to speak to the youngsters and say hey it's a tough time to be a police officer because yes and no you know um when you talk about new officers coming on the force this is this is their normal you know this is this is to them this is all they know they don't know the old times that that we you know that i lived through um so this is their normal so now we have to rather than say hey you do you know what you're getting into do you see what's going on the news you know it's it's the leader's responsibility to say hey you know this is how we're going to deal with this and basically just guide them you know into what the new normal is i guess okay so for me when i when i look at people that have roles such as yours um i'm always fascinated by some of the key stepping stones that may have led you to either have the insights or the points of reference that you've got so i don't know if you have any key moments that you can share that might be something that either happened to you that you experienced and observed or a piece of counsel that you were given uh that or a book that you read it might be but the stuff some of the things that maybe gave you those steps that say when that happened to me or when i read that or whatever it was that's when i felt myself moving forward as a leader i mean we've got the date the daily experiences but then there often there are key moments or an individual or be lovely to hear that um like you know i i started mentioning earlier that i'm you know having the charisma and and you know just learning from your from from encounters um basically but um i i try to sit back and after every situation and say okay was this uh beneficial or was it not you know what i mean could i have gone about this um a different way so the second nature leadership uh part of it is that um you know we have to everyone has habits right um it's about making your habits second nature okay so for example standing up every time somebody comes in my office and it seems like a minor thing and you know but it makes a big deal it's not second nature to me um to do that and you know it's it's not one you know one incident in particular um basically it's it's every encounter that i've had that i've i've set back and reflected to see if it was um if it was beneficial and and and and the encounter to the person um but no i mean i could tell you it you know i i speak about uh leading through a crisis now with with the virus going on and stuff like that we're in south florida so we're not uh does that having our world turn upside down it's not it's nothing new to us we have hurricane seasons and they did you know they rock our world uh every couple of years and um you know i leading through a crisis out you know i many people emulate their their mentors and you know for me a lot of my motivation has been from seeing an effective leadership however um during uh hurricane irma this is one one incident in particular that i feel like our the mayor of our of our city was able to see you know my worth as far as being out there um i was out there for five days without coming home um and and i did make a little mention of it in the book where we're out there at a low low income uh trailer park and our mayor was there on the front lines with us you know and he wasn't shaving and you know in police work we got to be you know nice and clean and we you know at one point he tells me uh you know what go home and get some rest and i said you know with all due respect i'm going to be here to the end um i was a sergeant at the time and um you know and you know he kind of gave me a look you know and i said you know what i'm gonna if you're here i'm here you know so you know he was my motivation for for that particular uh disaster let's say you know that we were having but also i was a sergeant so i wanted my guys to see me there as well you know so definitely i'm watching him i said i know they're watching me you know so i had to be there so i knew my family was home safe you know they didn't have any power but i had ever everything set up you know you know shortly after everything came back to normal the mayor brought me in and and promoted me to lieutenant you know what i mean so there's there's definitely you know turning points in your life that you have to you know capitalize on not not necessarily for your gain but just for you know for your betterment you know um so yeah a lot of incidents like that that you know that i sit back and reflect and say what if i would have gone home what if i would have you know talk to this person differently it's a lot of self-reflection um definitely i'm very i'm very interested in that i think there's a couple of things i mean one is i tend to believe that you can consciously develop yourself you can say right i am i want to get better at what i'm what i'm hearing from you potentially is almost like um i mean this is why it's probably the what's called second nature is um when you make something your identity when you make it that's what i'm about then i suppose that's one of the stepping stones to this idea of second nature because that's what that's how i identify myself that's the human being i'm trying to be that's the right the story i want to be told and i think maybe when you're doing that kind of thing um good things happen to you generally speaking because people don't feel there's a an ulterior motive to what you're doing they trust the integrity of it so if it's i'll be here till you're going home because then you'll give me a promotion that probably wouldn't work definitely that was the last thing on my mind yeah because that person if they've got that emotional intelligence looks at you and goes oh that's genuine and there's a big difference i think and i think people pick up on that of course definitely definitely yeah so for you in the role that you're in um you know i see this and i hear this reflection i hear this constant kind of uh that definition of self that this is a second nature of that that reflecting and considering does it are there ever hard times to stay on that path of doing things right and the right way um yes and no you know there's uh there's there's definitely things that do not come natural to me um i think you're you're born with a lot of qualities um and you're born with uh certain actions that that come from your genetic makeover uh and then talk about my father in the beginning of the book how it was uh his ways was appropriate for the times um but you know he was a pretty hardcore uh manager he was a leader but he definitely was almost my way or the highway which like i said definitely better better in those times but um so yeah you're i think you're you just you know we come from our parents we're gonna we're gonna you know have their dna and some of their their you know qualities and an effective quality so but we have to be able to learn from you know the way we are we just because just because you have that you know in your genetic makeover and your dna you know you there's there's no reason you cannot change um you can't change your your way so that they do become second nature habits you know and that's the main thing as you said is you have to acknowledge you know after a situation occurs you say okay did i have to do that or could i have done it a different way you know so um yeah very very very easy read the book down the earth a lot of a lot of real life encounters as such um and yeah definitely there there are times where where i do have a hard time staying on track but the key is and like i tell everyone is that you have to self reflect and you have to you know you have to identify it before you could change the habit um but sure i i would say yes you know definitely sometimes you know hard to stay on track so if you're okay just there's a couple of chapters in the book that i think have got great titles and um it'd be great just to just get a sense of what those chapters are about potentially one of my favorite ones is sometimes your coffee has to get cold yeah i'm even intriguing yeah even if i didn't read the chapter i think that sounds awesome um yeah what does that mean sometimes your coffee has to get cold okay so yeah so definitely that that was uh a real life encounter that that occurred in our organization so we have a we have a communications uh center which is basically the uh the personnel who dispatch the calls when you call the police they get the information and the dispenser calls and uh and i i i practice a daily routine that i call checking the pulse and what i mean by that is that i i physically go out to every office in the building of course time permitting and and i you know i don't walk over and actually check the polls but what i'm doing is i'm trying to get a feel for the employees that day um so i spend i spend a lot it takes about first hour of my day you know and i walk around with my with my cup of coffee um and it's a good time to you know get feedback from from bi i try to make the encounters a little personal rather than work related if i know someone you know someone's kid was sick or you know i i'll call them my name hey how's joe doing how's you know um and and if that leads to you know to work related uh issues that need tending to um it's a win-win you know i could use that opportunity to um to address the issues um but with the coffee situation that so yeah i had my coffee in my hand and i was talking to one of the communications officers and there was someone in the lobby um she said there's a lady in the lobby she's been out there for a while um i think she's crazy you know she's you know she said this that and that and you know i said okay i said well let me see if i could take care of her her concern so i set the cup of coffee down in the in the communications office and i made it out to the lobby and um you know it was a jurisdiction issue it had nothing to do with our area however she's been thrown around to different police departments so i basically in that situation i just you know i i tried to tend to her concerns the best i could i gave her as much information as i could um and i think she was happy i think overall she was happy i didn't totally resolve her issues but i i guided you know our customer i'm going to call her our customer because you know basically the public is our customer um i come inside to the communications office and and she says was she crazy and i said well not really she just was trying to um take care of x y and z which the other agencies could not take care of but i guided her in the right place she says um yeah so now your coffee's cold you know so i said yeah it's okay you know so i you know i kept talking to her and then like a second time she told me well now your coffee's cold and and i you know i turned over to her i said you know what sometimes your coffee has to get cold you know um so basically that that encounter was a a quick moment to you know make a note that wow you know you know you don't have to wait for formal training sessions to to to train employees and guide them on the right thing to do you know easily they could have taken care of it as well but she was able to see the way i i took care of the situation um and all it cost me was a you know cup of coffee and we had a happy customer you know so definitely that you know that was the the guide to everything else that's in that chapter but um hey i went over for a new cup of coffee big deal you know i love the analogy of just uh something well maybe it's sometimes you've got to park your agenda sometimes something just has to go on something has to go on hold because yeah actually i've got to deal with the thing that's in front of me right and uh yeah that's that's it's a it's a simple phrase but i love it and i think it really helps yeah similarly i catch myself on my computer when someone comes into the office to speak to me you know sometimes i say you know what let me let me just you know put this on hold and it's the same thing you know it's your cell phone we all have them you know we're looking down at them you're getting attacks you know someone's inside my office i try to turn my phone upside down or if a text comes in i'll look make sure it's not you know home with a family emergency i'll just get a little glance of it i i won't touch it you know i won't touch it as for you know current times now everybody's talking and they're on their phones you know um so yeah it's basically just you know what cold coffee it is or or we'll make a new pot you know that's it so great and uh do you have did you have a sense of i mean i i i don't know if you i've ever thought about it but i i was so harassed in doing my first book that um primarily because i didn't know how to get it out i think and then i was i was lucky to meet somebody that gave me some advice and i was like ah okay that's that's that's what i'm doing wrong but i i together do you have a second you know book in mind i mean i know i'm toying with the idea but i've got the anxiety of the effort involved yeah yeah definitely there's i'm i'm working on book number two okay um overall uh what i'm gonna uh attempt to discover is basically uh you know what made the difference um what what made the difference in in other organizations and uh and and i'm trying to i could relate my you know corporate america corporate life to to police work you know just as uh you recently had uh major general paul nansen correct on on the show and and it was interesting to to i told you i'm a big fan you are right so it was interesting to see him uh speak about the army world you know leadership and how it it pertains to the civilian world so my personal experience with you know with with the corporation um and then coming into to to police work was basically i found it to be very similar it didn't matter what the job was it was basically you know leading this organization and leading that organization is is you're working with people and you're dealing with people you know and in a leadership position you're you're dealing less with a customer and you're dealing more with the personnel that deal with the customer right so um yeah i want to do some research and i'd like i'd like to i'd like to investigate right that's a good word so police i would like to to investigate what made the difference or what is making the difference or what has made the difference in in other organizations what leaders of what other organizations are doing and have done uh basically to make a difference in their organization so yeah that that that's the going to be the premise for for book number two definitely in the works i thanks for asking no i mean it's just when it comes out we'll definitely talk about it but uh well we might have a little race then to see you see i i might my book wasn't um an e-book either until somebody gently harassed me and went i only read ebooks and i was like well i haven't i haven't made an e-book so now i feel as if i might parallel my getting myself in gear and trying to get mine out but uh so listen um in in terms of uh second nature leadership um how is how what's the feedback being what what's the um you know what what are you getting back as feedback i'm getting great feedback i'm very happy about the feedback i'm receiving and i think it has a lot to do with that it is it is different um than what is out there in a way um you know reading a guy reading your book it's some of the stuff in here you know it's it's it like related so much you know to my book when you talk about the the generations and how you know kids nowadays that they type in unicorn right into uh into a search engine and they don't get it back in a second um they're freaking out right so uh you know and i write about generations in my book and custom leadership is the name of the chapter is that you know you can't supervise a 25-year veteran the same way you do you know the new the new guys coming in um so while a lot of it you can relate to all the leadership books that are out there yours being one of them um it's it's an easy read like i said and and it's it's it's uh day-to-day interactions and and i tried to leave out a lot a lot of the the charge graphs and you know statistics and while they are important however in in this particular book um i think people are saying hey i like the way you talked about your father i like the way you talked about you know the young generation you know and speaking generations that i actually had an officer you know fill out a handwritten uh form and take a picture of it you know and i saw him take a picture i'm like you know it's something that had to go up to chain of command i said does this guy think i'm not going to turn it in or what's going on here i said you know let me not jump to conclusions um so as he handed me the form i said hey you mind me asking why you took a picture of the forum and he says well i could proofread it better on my device you know you know before jumping to conclusions say what the heck are you talking about you know it it dawned on me that if i write a memorandum or something on a computer i could proofread it better if i print out the form you know what i mean so i'm saying okay i'm a little older than this guy i i need to print it out and then i'll find my mistakes it's the total opposite you know so um situations like that i think that is is what's giving me the best feedback for the book it's the day-to-day interactions and and actual uh occurrences you know that have occurred but i'm very very happy with the feedback very happy you know you know i'm a police lieutenant i'm technically not an author i guess i am now so you know you know even to have somebody ask me to sign the book it's like you join me really you want me to sign the book you know so it's pretty neat it's great feedback and i'm happy with i'm ready to move on to book number two it's a it's a beautiful thing when um my eight-year-old said um well initially when i was writing the book i said you know daddy's writing a book and he went yeah but you're you're not an author and i was like no no no i'm not but when the book's published i'll be an author and he went you know i was like you know so there is little moments but you're right when somebody actually um wrote an unsolicited amazon recommendation so i didn't know who he was i didn't know where it had come from i couldn't have been happier you know it was just you know it was just one of those moments where you just go yes i had i had a similar occurrence i was sitting on the couch and i looked at the barney nobles review and i told my wife look at this and she's like who's that i go i don't know she goes are you sure you don't know who that is i don't know who it is and we're celebrating yeah you know so yeah definitely great feeling it's definitely a great feeling guy so listen um freddie i'll call this to a close you know this is um you know this was a get to know you this was to give the book a little bit of publicity i think it's uh it's a beautiful thing and i think you're a good guy and um you know i you know one one never knows but if it just helps uh then you know i think for for for people i know it's on amazon uh because i ordered it to get it so um you know definitely check out second the second nature leadership i'll put the link in the description and we'll we'll see if it helps but on just on a personal note thank you for giving me um some of your time freddie thanks for having me on i appreciate it okay absolutely well don't go away we'll have a little chat afterwards but i'm just going to press stop[Music] you